Like Intel Before It, Amd Blames Motherboard Makers for Burnt-Out Cpus
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The debate rages on as AMD shifts the blame for burnt-out CPUs to motherboard makers, echoing Intel's previous stance. Commenters weigh in on the pros and cons of vertical integration, with some praising Apple's approach for clear accountability, while others argue that DIY systems offer valuable flexibility and upgrade options. The discussion reveals a consensus that manufacturers should stand behind their products, with one commenter drawing an analogy between Dell's responsibility to Intel and Toyota's to Takata. As the banter unfolds, humorous takes on AMD's potential next move, like blaming consumers for "holding it wrong," add a lighthearted touch to the conversation.
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DIY systems are perhaps the ones most affected by this, but I don't think Apple caters at all to that segment.
For me that’s well worth being liable for installation issues.
Personally, I don't miss it, as I'm 100% laptop. If I was into PC gaming, I'd probably have a desktop, but I prefer the simplicity of consoles.
FWIW: Most people who buy laptops are buying at a price point where it's "not worth it" to repair.
I miss it a little. I have a 16GB MacBook Pro that I wouldn't mind adding more RAM to. But I think it's a worthwhile tradeoff for better performance, size, and power consumption.
"You're holding it wrong", Steve Jobs to a customer that covered their invisible antenna.
Here is what Nokia N97 does when you "hold it wrong":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shR4jITiG48
https://archive.is/20240401152946/https://www.wired.com/2010...
Steve Jobs: "You're holding it wrong"
It’s no mechanical keyboard to the fingers, but it worked fine.
AMD does not sell the motherboard. The motherboard sells the CPU. So motherboard is responsible.
But the relevance here is CPU is burning out because it is being plugged in by the end user. And the manufacturer is blaming the motherboard for their cpu burning. Maybe the cpu should be protective?
Dell support has flown a repair guy to my place with spare hardware pieces and fixed my pc in front of me. In my office. And I was partially to blame for the problem (I over clocked the CPU). I told them I did oc the CPU, they changed motherboard and processor anyways. For free.
So not only there are other verticals, but they are better.
That was a huge boost for Dell in my mind.
In my case, flying someone to my place alone was more expensive than the parts they replaced.
I can think of a bad one where a significant number of laptops and 1st party docking stations were deployed. There was an issue where in certain scenarios plugging into the dock would brick the dock. It affected ~5% of the population in 90 days. Vendor response: fuck you.
One of the interns working on desktop support at the org figured out that certain laptop serial number ranges were affected. She then popped it open and found what turned out to be a counterfeit chip.
Flying monkeys were released and the CEO of the vendor got a call. End result: ~$40-50M redeployment of everything, eaten by the vendor. If they had been accountable from the beginning, they likely would have recalled $3-5M of devices and spent $300-500k on deployment.
On the flip, I remember one scenario where an off warranty device failed before its replacement was ready (and the replacement was another vendor). The part wasn’t available locally, and the account exec ditched a conference in Chicago, picked up the part from a depot in Indiana and drove it to Massachusetts overnight, with a CE waiting for it in the lot.
It really doesn’t matter what the organization’s policies and procedures are. At most, an organization’s culture may affect this, by nudging marginal cases to align with the culture. But in the end, it always comes down to individual human beings.
Funny how experiences with the same company can be so drastically different. You got white glove service. I got service so bad that I used my veto power to keep an employer from ever spending a single penny with them.
They offer... what? The same insurance one might get at Boost Mobile.
edit: To be fair, I haven't read your link/agree in spirit: faulty is faulty, responsibility, etc. There is a difference, though.
And yet, they doubled down hard on refusing to replace my defective 6 month old, still under warranty, screen. Amazon was the hero in this story. They listened to my story and gave me a refund, which I spent with a different brand.
It felt wonderful explaining to their enterprise rep why we were rejecting their bid and going with a different vendor.
[1] https://www.buffalo.edu/news/tipsheets/2024/amazon-commingli...
Without knowing that, we can't put your anecdote in context.
Just try to buy a desktop machine and you'll see it as an option.
An example: https://i.imgur.com/sSVnfjb.png
The important part: "On-location repairs, by Dell certified technicians, after remote diagnosis (1-2 business days)".
There's no special business contract or paperwork involved.
And you can get it for free in promos. Like it did.
As to "Dell support has flown a repair guy to my place with spare hardware pieces ". You don't know that he wasn't already planning to fly to your area for 5+ other customers anyway. Also it's a less impressive story if you live in a heavily tech area than if you live in the Ozarks. Flights can often be cheaper than driving, and the rep has less dead/travel time and can service other customers or whatever.
I looked at Dell extended warranties before (can be ~about as expensive as the machine itself, over 3yrs) and figured that if you're buying with your own money, you can do better with due diligence on which specific year-models are/aren't reliable and what each component costs to replace, also couple that with a selective backup strategy. As long as you're not too remote.
I can tell you that wasn't the case because it was a small town that had a small airport. And they sent the guy next-day from my report. He told me he just flew for my issue and was returning on the same day.
If it was some large city or capital, they probably wouldn't have needed to fly the tech guy anyway. Someone would have probably been available nearby.
As for the price, perhaps it changes for different hardware, but for customer PCs you can see for yourself, it's around ~$45 per year. Which was free for me because of promo.
I just find it amazing that for home desktop PC customers, $45/y gets you 1-2 business day repair in your office.
It was a low-end one (their now-dead 'Vostro' brand), which may explain the service difference, I suppose.
Last five pcs and laptops I bought personally were all Dell. Latest latitude I bought worked with OpenBSD with no issues.
God, there's SO many examples of Apple being terrible.
That sounds good in theory, but if it were true people like Louis Rossman who repair Apple phones and laptops and talk about Apple's treatment of customers wouldn't have millions of followers on YouTube.
Or what about the butterfly keyboard issue? https://www.pcmag.com/news/apple-finally-begins-distributing.... I can't believe I had to periodically use compressed air to get my keyboard working again. Again, they kept denying it was an issue.
“You’re holding it wrong”
>and how long did you have it?
9 months
>Did you do anything to it (overclock, change the voltage)?
Nothing, I just enabled resizable bar in bios and that's it
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45041743 ("GMP damaging Zen 5 CPUs? (gmplib.org)"—18 hours ago, 192 comments)
> While similar, it is not the widely reported Asrock motherboard problem, as the motherboards we use are of a different make
The problem with Intel blaming 13th and 14th gen failures on motherboard manufacturers was that it happened even on motherboards which followed Intel's guidance to a T. This Ars Technica article doesn't seem to even try to make the argument that motherboard manufacturers are innocent, so the comparison to 13th and 14th gen failures is completely unwarranted.
Further, the article doesn't even investigate whether or not AMD's claim is correct. They could've compared AMD's max voltage specifications to the default settings configured by various motherboards.
Regardless, if ain't broken, don't break it.
My previous Gigabyte motherboard had unstable TSC, incorrect IOMMU configuration, broken PSP and CPPC. My current Asus board also has C-state weirdness and broken ASPM and it killed one CPU(!) on default settings. I won't even go into all the bugs I've encountered with Lenovo laptops, ACPI bugs, ASPM bugs, Pluton bugs and so on and on.
So yes, MOBO manufacturers, users bare equal responsibility, a chance to make lots of money & commission from the former, the need to be the first to try cutting edge technology without regards for proper safety, limitations and hardware compatibility, from the latter.
It seems that over the decades, people have failed to learn or neglected, Moore's Law's increasing physical limitations, because hey why not ;)
The users do not bear responsibility here. It's up to the manufacturer to say no if it's not possible.
And why are managers testing new GPU/mobo combinations? A company run like that and not learning lessons deserves to fail.
Yes, a company like that and not learning lessons deserves to fail. The problem is that there are too many young uneducated graduates, that were never taught to distinguish the truth from myth. Garbage companies and their greed continue to take advantage of their naivety because they know the industry is f**ed and there is no real way to make a sustainable living. The economies are, have been, and will continue to be messed up. Just take a look around and see how jobs are nonexistent. Those jobs that do exists, are few and far between. People mostly get hired by knowing someone in a company, a friend, a family member that can recommend them. There will never be enough jobs for everyone.
Basically, the company is crap, a by-product of a long-declining, garbage-industry, based on political policies and lies from the past. It reminds me of the "Never-ending story,". Recycle, repeat! Recycle, repeat! Never Innovate :(
Sol Roth
But it has to be said, that it in this specific instance it seems that only asorck is affected (and has been for months at this point thanks to GN investigation) so my bet is to just wait and see what happens.
https://docs.hetzner.com/robot/dedicated-server/general-info...